Does Batman die in The Dark Knight Rises? This seems to be the question on everyone's lips after David Letterman publicly declared that Batman was dead on his show last week. Christopher Nolan's Batman trilogy may be over, but that does not mean someone else cannot pick up the mantle and continue the adventures.
Spoilers ahead - DO NOT read unless you have seen the Dark Knight Rises!
Bane's presence in The Dark Knight Rises should be an indicator of sorts if you are a fan of the comics. Bane is known for breaking Batman's back in the DC Comics. Similar to Christopher Nolan's Inception, where Leonardo DiCaprio spins the top and the film ends abruptly, you are left wondering did it topple or did it keep spinning?
In The Dark Knight Rises, Catwoman (Anne Hathaway) appears on the Batpod and kills Bane after Talia Al Ghul (Miranda Kate) wounds Batman. In order to prevent Bane's masterplan of using the Nuclear Fission Device developed by Lucius Fox (Morgan Freeman) from Wayne Enterprises to destroy Gotham, Batman puts it inside the Bat and flies it out to sea. The resulting explosion doesn't kill anyone and Batman's body is never found.
Alfred (Michael Caine) is alone once more and decides to continue his travels around the world in his master's absence. When he visits Paris, an earlier memory in the film is alluded to where Alfred had discussed Bruce's happiness with him. Alfred then sees Bruce Wayne with Selina Kyle seated next to him in a cafe. They both acknowledge each other. This scene is more likely to be a metaphor for Bruce finally having found peace and happiness, so it would seem Batman dies. This is a typical Christopher Nolan ending, open to interpretation.
The end of the film also features Officer John Blake (Joseph Gordon-Levitt), who is still searching for Bruce Wayne, and ventures into the abandoned Wayne Manor after Alfred leaves. He discovers the concealed waterfall entrance into the Batcave, and trips a switch, raising the platform wherein Batman's iconic outfit is stored.
Blake is also referred by his Christian name of Robin when he picks up a uniform that has been left behind by Wayne. This could be a lead into the next set of films.
With all of this and the final film in Nolan's trilogy finally upon us, do you think this all means that Batman dies? Does Batman die in the Dark Knight Rises? Comment below on your thoughts?
Update: A few inconsistencies above have since been updated based on comments below.
Lame ending!! Typical superhero movie ending. Not impressive
ReplyDeleteThey needed to wrap it somehow I guess
Deleteyeah but they didn't have to kill him and get a new life it could have waited for the next movie
DeleteThe ending is much better than most think. Nolan intended to make many fans think of possible interpretations. People will watch the movie again to connect the dots. This is an intricate narrative.
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batman could still be alive you know, think about it, after the explosion there was a scene where some people were talking about bruce wayne servicing a vehicle and something about auto pilot, why would they put a scene in about auto pilot, im guessing batman jumped out before it?...
DeleteMy thoughts are this:-
DeleteBruce Wayne is dead at the end of this film. Nolan has left this open to debate with the scenes with Fox and Alfred at the end and as Bane aptly puts it 'there can be no despair without hope' which I think Nolan wants the audience to experience at the end with the ambiguous 'is he isn't he'. But Batman is still in the Bat when the bomb has been taken away from the city with circa 10 seconds left before the bomb, covering a 6 mile radius, detonates. Not long enough for him to escape to safety.
Also Alfred's reaction to seeing his best friend, who he thought was dead, sat down in Florence at the end is not emotionally strong enough to believe that he is physically seeing him in the flesh.
p.s I didn't like the path of Bane throughout the film. He was menacing and a seemingly strong leader throughout unti the twist came when he instantly turned into an emotional obedient puppy dog. And then got shot by cat woman. haha
I pretty much agree.Although there is some good evidence he survives , it's not as strong as it first appears. Firstly , people have pointed out the fact that the auto-pilot is fixed , it is certainly suggestive but obviously it still does not explain how batman escaped the bat with five seconds to go before an atomic bomb with a radius of six miles goes off. Saying he survived because he's batman is kind of lame. Others have mentioned the repaired bat-signal scene but even this is misleading. At the end of Batman Begins, Batman arrives on top of Police HQ and taps the bat-signal saying " nice " to Gordon. It is one of the few gadgets that doesn't seem to have been created by batman , and batman's words implies he did not make it. Besides , when it is repaired in the Dark Knight Rises ending , it is not strange that it could have been repaired by someone else , after all , the people of Gotham and especially the police now know batman's a hero and saved them all. Personally , I think the best evidence that he is alive lies with the necklace. If the scene where Alfred sees Bruce and Selina in the cafe in florence is imaginary , it is quite telling to include the necklace around Selina's neck. It is only visible for a brief moment before she turns and the light on her back gets brighter making it disappear but it is visible for a moment.We know that the necklace is reported missing as the lawyers are discussing bruce wayne's will and estate in an earlier scene.Also , if the moment in the cafe is real , it seems strange that Alfred would imagine Bruce and Selina in the first place , he barely met her earlier in the film.Also as you pointed out , his reaction to seeing Bruce alive after thinking he was dead is so calm rather than overwhelming or emotional which suggests that perhaps it is a dream or fantasy. In the end , it is very difficult to tell , there are so many clues which could make either scenario possible.I am sure others will perhaps add factors that I have missed but for the moment I am 50/50 about whether batman survived or not. Until I hear a good argument of how he escaped the Bat with five seconds to go , generally I do not see how he could possibly survive.
DeleteWhoops , sorry meant to say " if the moment in the cafe is imaginary " not " if the moment in the cafe is real " as I wrote above . my bad.
Deletemaybe superman saved him .
DeleteIt's not a dream. Or, what's the sense of the last scenes?
DeleteTo mix the reality (Robin in the batcave) and the imagination (Alfred)? NO WAY!
It's true! It's Bruce! He's alive! Point.
Or where is the object at the end? On Selina's neck!
Last month Bale changed his stance on a future Batman movie. Not ruling out another film in the future. Probably see some type of Nightwing film, and revisit Batman in his later years? Nolan would be terrific to bring the Frank Miller story to the big scream.
ReplyDeleteThat would be a great visual style to take the Batman movies down, good idea!
DeleteBlake is possibly going to become Nightwing.
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Or I Think Blake Is Really Tim Drake(The Third Male Robin) And In The Comic Books When Batman Goes Missing(Much Like The Ending Of The Movie) Tim Drake Has To Become The New Batman, But If Not I Think Steve Blake Will become Red Robin And Not NightWing
DeleteHe won't become night wing until later. He has to be robin before night wing, if you read the comics Batman trains robin into becoming a better hero. Good enough to become his own super hero therefore Nightwing was born.
DeleteBlake won't be Nightwing first of all because Dick Grayson is Nightwing in the comics and it's imposible that a guy like Blake ends up as NW anyways i think your point is right Anonymous 1 he will eventually be the 3rd Robin as in comics Tim Drake is Robin (Drake - Blake coincidence?) now the final part of the movie was ok, but i don't know if we can take any conclusions yet, Nolan is giving us lot to think of.
DeleteDon't know which film you saw, but it can't have been TDKR. This isn't what happens.
ReplyDeleteso what happens?
DeleteThis is the ending folks. Does Batman dies in the Dark Knight? What do you think?
DeleteI think you all missed a major part of this ending. When Fox asks about if he could have fixed the bat, he is told that it was fixed six months ago, by Bruce Wayne. That pretty much proves he is still alive as he used the autopilot to save himself.
DeleteI just came from the movie, and there are glaring inconsistencies (both characters involved as well as the events themselves) in this article. One key event not noted at all is the one that Alex noted above me -- the discussion of the autopilot that provides the loophole allowing Batman to safely escape the blast, in addition to events before and after that hint towards that conclusion. I appreciate this blogger's effort to provide people with guidance, but unfortunately s/he was either watching a different movie or not devoting enough attention to the movie -- certainly no where near the amount requisite to write any sort of review. In any case, these readers have been led astray.
DeleteThis is not a review, it's a discussion/debate. Yes, the auto pilot was fixed, as numerous people have outlined in the comments, but how exactly did Batman jump from the Bat and survive a nuclear/atomic explosion when he was seen piloting the Bat seconds before it exploded?
DeleteIt was a neutron bomb, it is a type of thermonuclear weapon designed specifically to release a large portion of its energy as energetic neutron radiation (fast neutrons) rather than explosive energy. These bombs are not made to vaporise cities, just kill all life forms. His suit saved him.
Deletenow personally, i believe that batman is dead, and here's why.
Deletei do not view nolan's to be so black and white, believing every detail that the director inserts. in my opinion, nolan put the scene of the autopilot to slightly mislead the viewer into thinking everything was peachy-keen and fine. but we know batman is much more of a complicated character than one who would just exile himself. maybe he personally fixed the bat to show others that he needed to die in order for gotham to succeed, even though he had an out. compare the final paris cafe scene to that of inception's. would it be so clear cut that it was reality? i think the answer is no, or at least no one will ever know.
and how is a batsuit supposed to save a human from a neutron radiation blast. how did you come to this conclusion even though nothing in the movie was ever referenced to anti-radiation suit, yet you seem so clear to conclude that batman lives and berate those who think otherwise.
god forbid, movies with metaphors and symbology! and god forbid a reviewer posting their interpretations!
It is said that Bruce Wayne fixed the auto-pilot of the Bat 6 months prior to the explosion. The biggest argument for this is "Well he was in the Bat seconds before the explosion, he couldn't have gotten out on time". My comment to that is it's Auto-pilot. There is no purpose for it if you're going to jump out a second before it blows up. Auto-pilot is used to pilot a craft on its own to a set destination, etc. Obviously, Batman ejected long before the detonation period. Who's to say he isn't seen driving a Bat-Sub or a Tumbler, or some other misc. vehicle ?? It's clear to me that Bruce Wayne survived.
DeleteGood point , I thought about that as well but wasn't sure at first. Everyone assumes it is the Bat he is in the five seconds before it is destroyed, perhaps it is not. If he is actually in something else , then this would make the " Bruce Wayne alive theory " much stronger.
DeleteLook, Batman said to Catwoman "I haven't given everything yet" obviously this means the most you can give is your life. He dies in the end. If he were in another vehicle why would he have a grim face of accepting death. I agree with digza, you want him to survive and therefore Nolan feeds your desire, but really, you know there's much more that. I think saying the "Dark Knight Rises" having the purpose (in the title) of suggesting he rises to heaven, as i think religious allegory is often tripe. However i believe he does rise to the ultimate challenge of giving everything. SECONDLY IT'S NOT PARIS, IT'S FLORENCE. IT'S NOT FISSION, IT'S FUSION!!!!!!
DeleteActually just got back from the movie , Its all true whats said except for when alfred stands up and walks , that never happens , he sits their looks , and you see bruce and selina sitting at the table , and alfred smiles and bruce smiles back and then alfred gets up and walks away , I'm pretty sure bruce faked his own death and him and selina started over , a new life , and possibly left the plate to robin.
ReplyDeletePretty sure? ;-)
DeleteThe movie is not even in theaters yet :D
Deletealso whhen bruce gives the slate to change names and be free to selina so bruce and selina problaly both used the slate and started over
Delete"Batman" dies but Bruce lives...and Talia Al Ghu DID NOT KILL Bane!!! don't know what movie you watched but she instead stabs Batman with a knife..she and Bane were working together...Pay attention when watching a film....CATWOMAN kills Bane by blasting him with a cannon mounted on the bat motorcycle...and Alfred does know that Bruce is alive because when he is sitting he looks at bruce and bruce looks back at him smiling...The Dark KNight rises could be seen as the end of batman but the beginning of Robin...because Robin inherits bruce Wayne's secret cave at the very end..
DeleteToo obvious. Nolan is using an Inception encoding in this sequence to suggest it is a dream. No way Batman survived the blast. His grim look speaks volumes that he is ready to overcome his fear of death to join his parents.
DeleteCan we go back and say Maximus survived in Gladiator? Maybe Commodus didn't stab his lung. Batman's suit did not save him. Sure, Batman survived and he treaded back to Gotham City, and then went along with Selina to Paris. Bruce wayne died in the blast.
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Batman is alive, alfred never knew that him and catwoman had a connection, and for him to imagine anne hathawayt there would mean in the only possible way that he is still alive
DeleteSee, at first, I thought he was dead because they mentioned in the movie about the auto pilot and Fox tells Bruce "You are the auto pilot." I must have missed when it was mentioned that was "fixed."
DeleteBut to get back to what you're saying, I thought it was just a dream Alfred was having, seeing Bruce happy in Paris, married, and enjoying life with his wife. However, it showed Salina Kyle, and Alfred never met her in the film.
I'm thinking the ending was left up to the viewer to decide. Nolan is all about making the fans happy. So leaving Bruce's fate in their hands would be the logical thing for him to do.
One thing is for sure, regardless of how you interpret the ending, Batman is dead. Bruce Wayne is a totally different scenario.
He sees Selina in the beginning. (the maid)
DeleteBut he wanted Bruce to date Miranda Tate.
There are a lot of things wrong with this review. For example, in the 3rd paragraph, it says "Talia Al Ghul (Miranda Kate) appears and kills Bane after Batman wounds him. In order to prevent Bane's masterplan of using the Nuclear Fission Device developed by Lucius Fox (Morgan Freeman) from Wayne Enterprises to destroy Gotham, Batman puts it inside the Bat and flies it into Gotham River. The resulting explosion doesn't kill anyone and the remains of the Bat wash ashore, but Batman's body is never found." First of all, Talia never kills Bane. Talia helped Bane after Batman was ready to subdue him. It was Selina Kyle, or Catwoman that killed him. 2nd of all, He didn't plunge the nuclear weapon into Gotham river, he flew into the horizon of some sort of ocean and it exploded. the Bat wasn't washed onto shore, and indeed no body would've been found because it was a ATOMIC BOMB. No body would've been evaporated anyways because Batman escaped before the bomb blew.
ReplyDeleteYes....Who wrote this should have done more research...
DeleteThe article has been updated to fix the inconsistencies
DeleteI'm sorry but youre wrong. It was not an Atomic bomb. It was a neutron bomb.
DeleteAs someone above said: "It was a neutron bomb, it is a type of thermonuclear weapon designed specifically to release a large portion of its energy as energetic neutron radiation (fast neutrons) rather than explosive energy. These bombs are not made to vaporise cities, just kill all life forms."
There is no shockwave/crushing pressure/eplosive power, and I do belive that Batmans suit is advanced enough to protect him from ultralight or overwhelmed energy.
IT'S NOT FISSION AND IT'S FLORENCE NOT PARIS!!!!
DeleteJust saw the film. Absolutely mind blowingly good !!!! Batman does survive and as Robin is introduced to us at the end of the film I would bet a million bucks we are all going to see a Batman and Robin film next from Nolan.....
ReplyDeleteNolan has said he's not doing any more Batman films unfortunately
Deletemaybe not any more "Batman" films, but quite possibly a "Batman AND Robin" film?
Deleteagree
DeleteDon't think so. Nolan most likely won't do the duo together, Bale is said to not be involved if Robin was brought in, (although that could have been said to throw everyone off) and doing a movie with just Robin as the hero wouldn't be able to come close to filling the shoes the other three films were in.
DeleteI think it was meant to be the final film with Nolan acknowledging that Gotham isn't going to magically be safe from impending evil yet it shows there is someone else there to take up the mantle and defend the city now that Batman is "dead."
FIRSTLY IT"S NOT NUCLEAR FISSION IT'S FUSION, WHY WOULD THERE BE ANY HYPE ABOUT SOMETHING THAT HAS BEEN ACCOMPLISHED AT LEAST TWO DECADES AGO.
DeleteSECONDLY IT'S NOT PARIS IT'S FLORENCE.
Yeah! Never say never
ReplyDeleteCan't imagine how much $ will be used to tempt Nolan into producing a Batman/Robin sequel. It'd be absolutely mind blowing!
ReplyDeleteWhere you even paying attention?! Catwoman kills Bane not Tahlia, and Alfred never gets up and walks over, he sees Bruce and Selina and know they are definitively alive. Also nothing is mentioned about the bat washing up?
ReplyDeleteWhoops, this has been fixed, should have read it properly before hitting publish :-P
DeleteIf I remember correctly, Christian Bale said he would never do a Batman movie with a Robin character. Perhaps he could change his mind if the Robin character was reinvented but that was an issue originally. Or maybe they get a new actor to play Batman.
ReplyDeleteI LOVE BATMAN HE CANT DIE!!! AND YOU KNOW WHY?
ReplyDeleteBECAUSE HES BATMAN!!!!!!!!!
DeleteYes he dies while saving the city from the nuclear bomb set by bains workers and minions. Saw it today.
DeleteHe sets the Bat on autopilot. Not only that, you freaking see him at the end of the movie with Selina Kyle...
DeleteRead some other comments, how could he survive the explosion seconds before it happens while he's still on the Bat? And, Alfred seeing him in France is thought to be a dream sequence
DeleteIf you remember at the beginning when Alfred said he would see an illusion of Bruce at the cafe, and every time he saw Bruce it ment he was ok. So it could have been an illusion just letting us know that batman could be dead or alive. Don't jump to conclusions yet guys. The only people who know all the truth is everyone involved with the dark night trilogy.
DeleteThe "Bat" had an escape pod which was protected from the radition from the bomb. Alfred was in Paris. It was not a dream. Bruce is alive.
DeleteChristopher Nolan is an amazing director, why would he make an inception ending, THIS IS BATMAN! NOT INCEPTION! YES IT IS DIRECTED BY THE SAME PERSON, BUT DO YOU SEE ANY THING LIKE THE LOST BOYS IN SCHUMACHER'S BATMAN MOVIES? BRUCE WAYNE SURVIVED, BATMAN MOVIES DONT HAVE TO BE 100% REALISTIC, HOW DID HARVEY DENT SPEAK WITH HALF HIS FACE MELTED OFF! BRUCE IS ALIVE AND WELL!
Deletesaw the movie i believe bruce faked his own death and he and selina used the "clean slate" that selina desired to actually clean the slate and start all over and he left the suit and the batcave to blake so he could take his throne and the main crime fighter in gotham and btw he fixed the batman spotlight also why would he do that if he was gonna die. but i also think the film it up for interpretation bc it could easily go either way and lead in to 2 different ways for the next movie either he is dead and robin honors him by fighting crime or robin fights crime and needs help in doing so and bruce returns to help robin maybe to fight the riddler or a new joker who never was actually killed
ReplyDeleteThey aren't going to bring back The Joker because Heath died of an overdose so they let The Joker die with him.
DeleteHeath Ledger did a brilliant job as the Joker in The Dark Knight
Deletethey will never bring back The Joker because the brilliant Heath Ledger died and they let the joker die with him. BTW The Joker in the Dark Knight was freaking amazing by far the best villain yet. I would like to see the riddler played by Jim Carrey
DeleteThere you go:
Deletehttp://popcracker.com/images/user-lib/user/popcrackerteam/comic%20book%20villains/1340268907riddler.jpg
remember that when batman ask catwoman to help him she said she would only blow up the blockade and then asked him to go with her and that he has already done enough for this city but he said he had to help. so he lived and started over with her bottom line
DeleteHey guys....... I am..... The batman! Shhhhhhhh
ReplyDeleteHey guys....... Iam..... Robin! Shhhhhhhh
DeleteHey guys...I'm Superman on Yahoo! Shhhhhhh
DeleteHmmmm....Batman does NOT die!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
ReplyDeleteAdditionally, Lucious is shocked to find out that the autopilot of The Bat had been fixed by Bruce Wayne 6 months before Batman used it to carry the nuclear bomb out to the sea.
FURTHERMORE, at the end of the movie they show him smiling back at Alfred in the Paris restaurant with Selina (Catwoman) sitting infront of him.
John Blake is given the coordinates to the Batcave and before the lady hands him the bag she tells John Blake, "Your full name is nice, you should us it, Robin."
It is MORE than clear that Batman does not die. I am unsure what the author of this article saw.
It is very clear that there is a 4th one coming, Batman and Robin.
In the beginning of the movie Alfred also tells wayne about getting out of there and starting a new life
DeleteDon't forget that the bat signal is fixed and Gordon notices this as he is working on the roof. There are too many hints that he is alive to try and make the viewer wonder if batman died in the blast. I agree batman is dead and gone for now....Bruce Wayne however is a totally different story.
DeleteBatman never diessssssss. Just brought out the old batman action figures!
ReplyDeleteI don't think he's dead. He's Batman, he could have flown before the nuclear device
ReplyDeleteexploded. I just can't recall what happened with Cat Woman but it would be good if they got together and were happy and not superheroes any longer.
The bomb's blast radius would have been huge!
DeleteI have no idea how you can defend this garbage.. Had you even seen the movie when you wrote this drivel??
DeleteYou are either intentionally trying to mess with people, or you're out of your depth and truly cannot understand probably the simplest movie ending Chris Nolan has ever made. There is no question about it. We never saw Batman die. However, we did see all of Batman's colleagues individually find clues to him surviving (i.e. Bat signal lamp repaired, auto-pilot repaired, Blake's inheritance, and last but certainly not least, ALFRED SEEING HIM WITH SELINA (Who by the way, he had no reason to imagine Bruce being with. If he was imagining it, Nolan probably would have stick Rachel in there to make it a bittersweet ending). If Nolan really wanted to mess with us, he would have shown us everything I've listed above up to Alfred's face smiling towards some unknown entity of camera which we the audience could then debate was or was not in fact Bruce Wayne.
This isn't Inception.. there's no mystery to dispel. This is as black and white as can be. Just a touch of perfectly placed intrigue to end the series on a high a note.
Not to mention, how could Nolan leave poor Alfred feeling so morbidly depressed and responsible for the death of his dead employers son.. It was truly a sad and horrible moment to see Alfred balling his eyes out at the grave.
Excellent job once again, Mr. Nolan. You never cease to amaze me. Keep up the great work.
Inconsistencies you pointed out are now fixed
DeleteKilling batman is un-American
ReplyDeleteNolan is British? :P
DeleteCouldn't believe that Bruce Wayne was Batman all along. I never saw that one coming.
ReplyDeleteLOL
DeleteI couldn't believe that Christian Bale was Bruce Wayne :-)
DeleteI LOVE BATMAN so in the movie near the end batman is stabed my taliuh by a sertain knife i think she may have posioned batman somehow i realy want to no... wait wouldnt he bleed out leading to his death in the end batman fakes his death if he didnt how would robin get those cords and find out how to get in nobody sees the details
ReplyDeleteBatman is not dead i am 100%. 1 Reason is that the auto pilot was fixed 6 momths ago and flew him out if there. 2nd of all the butler said he imagins Bruce and catwomen sitting across from him. Which he did see them in fact and smiled back. And in the middle remember about the clean slate thing. They proley started over a new life. Aldred said he will see him when he gives up being batman. Also that dude found the batcave and the suit was there fixed so yeah hes not dead.
ReplyDeletethats true if batman went into the bat with his suit then he returned and put the suit back and started a new life
DeleteWhat if he had multiple suits?
DeleteWe all know that he had some kind of a Bat Atomic Protection Device.... On his utility belt. 'Cause he's Batman.
ReplyDeleteBatman's utility belt is full of surprises :-)
Deleteeverybody is missing one important point here, That Nolan is extremely intelligent and he assumes the same for his audience. Keeping that in mind, the destruction radius of the 5 MT nuclear bomb was 6 miles,(not counting in the radiation fallout), and it also showed Batman flying the bat up to 3 or 4 seconds before detonation, this means escape was not physically possible since the bat wasn't supersonic or even anywhere close a commercial subsonic plane.(It didn't have turbofan or turbo jet engines).
ReplyDeletenow the fact that the Autopilot was fixed by Bruce Wayne 6 months prior, seems to suggest that Batman willingly decided to end the legend by flying the bat manually, while letting everyone believe he had no other choice.
again it's a typical Nolan's ending open to debate and different interpretations. This was mine.
You make some very good points here. I think Nolan is trying to keep people guessing if Batman dies or not
DeleteIt was a neutron bomb, these bombs are not made to vaporise cities, just kill all life forms with extreme amounts of radiation. Big difference between a neuton bomb and nuclear or atomic bomb. My 2 cents
DeleteYou clearly didn't watch this film. Alfred never approaches Bruce in FLORENCE. Talia Al Ghul doesn't kill Bane, Selina Kyle does. Get your facts straight. And your writing style is lacking in basic appeal. Step your mechanics up.
ReplyDeleteNothing like a bit of constructive criticism
DeleteNolan had said he is making no more 'Batman' movies, but he never said anything about a 'Batman and Robin' movie. Also the bat signal was fixed at the end of the movie which is also a large hint that batman /bruce wayne is alive.
ReplyDeleteJust watched the movie and since the autopilot for the bat was fixed 6 months before Batman flew the atomic bomb over seas, it means Batman is still alive! But Nolan is keeping the audience guessing by the end of the film and keeping his options open for his next film considering the amount of money he can make, there's no way he can pass over the opportunity to make a Robin and Batman movie :)
ReplyDeleteRobin as "Nightwing" is the only tone that works. Still, much as Ledger's Joker haunted the 3rd installment, I believe Nolan left it all on the table, here, and the weight of the entire Trilogy would haunt a 4th installment. Robin is simply meant to show that Bruce Wayne's vision from Batman Begins is fulfilled. Nolan is done.
ReplyDeleteBatman is dead! Batman and robin is underway
ReplyDeleteI would have to see again to be sure but we didn't see him fly after he fired rockets to clear the buildings out way. I believe he ejected before this and set auto pilot. But batman as a hero was seen to die so they won't look for him and he can finally relax
ReplyDeleteWe did see him fly after firing the rockets to clear the building. It is the high point of tension where Batman has a dire look on his face, finally facing the fear of death. He mentioned his fear of death in the pit prison. Batman died. He was in the plane with about 5 seconds left on the atomic bomb. no way he ejects to escape an atomic bomb that can cover a 2-4 square mile blast upon detonation. It is possible the water diminishes the impact, but it is still a large explosion.
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IT WASNT A ATOMIC BOMB!!Its a neutron!
DeleteSo then what was the whole deal with the auto-pilot in The Bat? Batman could have jumped out and the Bat keep flying or what?
ReplyDeleteAt the very end when it shows the bomb seconds away from detonating does it actually show batman in the cockpit or just the bomb and the bat flying?
ReplyDeleteSo why would Batman want to fake his own death and leave Gotham?(that doesnt sound much Batman-ish does it? Faking his own death and running away like a coward so that he can have a better life? Come on seriously, thats what you expect Batman to do?)
ReplyDeleteWhy cant he just leave without faking his own death?
Why cant he have a better life in Gotham?Not many people know his real identity right? Only a very few trusted allies of him knows who he really is.So if he had really moved on with his life, why cant he go into retirement and never don the bat suite again but still stay at Gotham?
Remember this letter ?
Dear Bruce. I need to be honest and clear. I'm going to marry Harvey Dent. I love him, and I want to spend the rest of my life with him. When I told you that if Gotham no longer needed Batman we could be together, I meant it. But now I'm sure the day won't come when *you* no longer need Batman. I hope it does; and if it does I will be there, but as your friend. I'm sorry to let you down. If you lose your faith in me, please keep your faith in people. Love, now and always, Rachel.
Even Rachel, one of the closest person to Bruce, knew that such a day wont come when Bruce no longer needs Batman. Then what sorcery happened in Rises that made Bruce move on ? He found Robin, a worthy successor to him! So now he can move on knowing that Gotham is in safe hands.This is good enough reason for him to move on? Maybe. But its stated in Rachel's letter that even if Gotham no longer needs Batman, such a day wont come when Bruce no longer needs Batman, and till now I think that was the point Nolan was trying to convince us, that Bruce cant live without Batman.
Now there is one strong point that suggests that Batman indeed survive in the end. (If Batman did survive I would call it really bad writing, as he didnt have enough motivations to fake his own death)
So firstly the BAT was recovered and it looked in pretty good shape for something that was in the vicinity of a nuclear blast, and the blast itself takes place inside the water not on the air, hence the mushroom rising from the water. If he had used auto pilot shouldnt the blast have occurred mid air? So what does it mean? could it mean Batman steered the BAT into water so that the effect of the blast could be minimized?Or could it have meant that he unhooked the rope to which the bomb was attached from the BAT, hence it fell in the water, and he flew away to a safe distance and survived? And later he decides to capitalize on the opportunity and fake his own death? Thats pretty sucky writing if you ask me but it explains everything, the not so much destroyed BAT, the water mushroom cloud and Bruce and Celina in Italy.... Please reply to this comment and please include the name 'Vish' in your reply cause other wise I will have a hard time sorting which comments are directed towards me and which are not.
Vish, good thinking. I'm one of the guys who believed Bruce Wayne died in the film. Based on Nolan's other works where he really liked to put 'imagination' and 'psychological problems' in there, I'd assume Alfred was hallucinating in the final scene.
DeleteThat's how I accept the ending. I mean, I can't accept the fact that he just survived the mega-gigantic bomb, even if it's using the autopilot feature. He must have gotten a bit of the blast, at least.
After all, he's batman, not a goddamned Goku from dragon ball series.
You also have to take into account all the information they told you about the bomb and the fact that bomb isn't a atomic bomb like everyone seems to think. His suit could have easily protected him for the most part from the bomb since he wouldn't have been right in the middle of the blast especially since it wasn't like the typical atom bomb that wipe's out city blocks. The reason they gave so much information on the bomb was so people with a little knowledge could know "well maybe it won't kill him" and that is also why they wanted to show the BAT at the end in good shape to further prove it was survivable.
DeletePersonally, I don't know what to think but nobody in their right mind can deny that Alfred saw Bruce and Selina at the end. Now if that was a dream/fantasy or what is up for interpretation but they showed nothing that would make you think it wasn't real.
Batman dies. Nolan has a major interest writing dream sequences. He expressed interest in writing another film about dreams in an interview released last year. You can see the difference in imaginary in the end. It is what Alfred wants to believe. Maybe Nolan wants movie fans to interpret the ending as most are doing here on this website. As many hits as we got on our top spoiler and ending sites, this website by far is outperforming us. We prepared a dozen TDKR articles.
DeleteThe atom bomb is not your typical bomb. Dr. Pavil stated the atomic bomb as a 6 megaton weapon. Have you read a Thousand Suns? 6 megaton bomb covers 2-4 square miles. Surely, land detonation is greater, but no way Batman survived that blast. He finally overcame his fear of death. His parents died, he hinted to Gordon his true identity in a hero mention, showed fear of death in the prison, and provided for the orphan kids and Alfred. Bruce makes us want to think it is possible he survived. Batman died in the explosion.
It is too obvious to show Bruce at a cafe in a real scene. Nolan writes complex narratives(i.e. Memento) Alfred experienced an emotional breakdown at the grave site. That Alfred sequence is a dream sequence. Maybe Alfred died in his sleep too, which his last thought is for Bruce to be happy.
movieexplantions.com
Dont you remeber when Alfred and Bruce were talking before Alfred left? Alfred said that there isnt anything good for Bruce in Gotham... just pain and grief. Or something along the lines of that
DeleteAstral Writer makes some very good points
DeleteThe style of these films wouldn't suit a Batman AND Robin movie. And if Bruce Wayne is alive, he has clearly settled down and is done being batman. I hope they make a Robin movie.
ReplyDeleteBatman's lame anyway so who cares...
ReplyDeleteit's a trilogy.. i highly doubt it.
ReplyDeleteChristopher Nolan said from the very beginning he would ONLY make the Dark Knight trilogy and that is it. He has said it for years and confirmed it again recently. The only thing changed now is Christian Bale is willing to do more Batman roles. Not to mention ALOT of credible sources have put Darren Aronofsky as the director for the next Batman film and that's got people up in arm's since he will never be able to make a proper Batman film.
ReplyDeletethe summary above is way off, read earlier comments for clarification.
ReplyDeleteBruce wayne lives, alfred alluded earlier in the movie for batman to find an outlet to his nightly heroics without him dying. It was foreshadowing for batman to die but bruce to live. "Catwoman" was that outlet for a new life. Also i want to note that the title of this movie throws me off,The Dark Knight RISES. "Batman" dies in the movie, but it is a selfless death. And the city realizes Batman's true nature that he was a good, incorruptible hero. I think the title represents the ascension of the public's view of Batman. Just a thought. But what DOESNT make sense to me is when Alfred is balling his eyes out at Bruce's grave after his "death." If Bruce infact did fix the autopilot six months ago, and tricked every one, wouldnt alfred have been way more ecstatic to see Bruce alive at Paris (i think). Im not saying Alfred would have been jumping up and down with relief because he said earlier that he wanted to see bruce their with a "wife" and for them never to speak again, but wouldn't Alfred atleast have shed a tear with rejoice? It's an inconsistency with what ive seen, maybe there's an inconsistency with the way I saw it.
Think Blake is going to become Nightwing. Batman is able to rise above his fear of dying. We know that he parents are murdered. Gordon comforts him as a child during this tragedy. Batman hints to Gordon that he is indeed Bruce Wayne through a hero reference connecting the Commissioner many years ago. I doubt Batman survived. It makes Batman fans want to think he survives. He was still in the slow moving Bat plane with about 5 seconds left. His facial expression that this is it is enough to suggest the ultimate sacrifice for the greater of good. Alfred end scene is likely a dream sequence. We know that Nolan is an advocate of dream movies.
ReplyDeletemovieexplantions.com
i hope there are many more batman movies. i just got back from the theaters and i loved batman dark night rises.
ReplyDeleteNice topic Steve, Unfortunatly, I found the ending to be the most enjoyable part of this film. I wish they had moved along JGL's plot and had that resolved in the first third of the film. I thought this was the weakest of the three Nolan films and I am glad he is moving on as it seems he may be out of bat related ideas. Hathaway was a pleasant surprise, Meow!
ReplyDeleteGlad you enjoyed it :-)
DeleteBatman is alive. Nolan wants you to think that he isnt. Blake will become Robin. Who could've built the Bat signal? Anybody tell me who could of built other then Bruce?
ReplyDeleteOkay so when the movie is at the ending they show the bat (the flying veihicle) fox tells the mechanics they need to fixthe auto pilot they say it was fixed 6 months ago and the id was bruce wayne so he fixed the auto pilot so what he did was jump out cause he could use auto pilot. So alfred goes to vince or wherever and eairlier in the movie he said he always imagened bruce sitting there with a wife and maybe kids so he looks up after getting his drink and brice nods at him fred nods back and walks away. The police officer/detective i forget his name but he gets cordinates to the bat cave and he is left with all the equipment it is believed he will be robin maybe evan the new batman. There is always room for the real batman (bruce) to come bavk but you never know.
ReplyDeleteInstead of making the officer become Robin, Nolan should have made him become batman. Batman is an idea not a person
ReplyDeleteOkay so i HAVE TO take this back to the dark knight. Batman should honestly die at the end of this movie, He is a legendary force, and Crime is an immovable object. this is what the joker referenced to in the end of that movie. Batman, left his legacy to Robin, to continue the fight. If this was to continue, the joker would Need to come back, as we all know, The joker, had his way with the boy wonder in the comic series, LOL. You see, If they try to follow the graphic novels It would be too much, it has to end here, otherwise it will end up like the earlier batman series, terrible and annoying with crappy lines and confusing plots, these movies have an adult sense to them and ending it now keeps it that way.
ReplyDeleteI just watched the Movie. Batman is not Dead... He left with Cat Woman... to start a new life... DC can always bring one or both back.
ReplyDeleteIn the past we would have Batman and Robin movies... we have not seen many... They might come back....
What movie did you watch?? Haha, I think you need to pay more attention to the movie next time.. :)
ReplyDeleteIf Batman is dead then they can't make a Batman AND Robin movie. So I think there might just be a Robin movie because Nolan said he was done with the Batman movies.
ReplyDeleteIt's really sad that most folks are unable to read the nuances inherent in the ending... and then get so aggressive when their own 2 dimensional brains short out. I believe that Nolan conceived a definite end for his incarnation of Batman; it seems to me that there's probably not much that Batman could have done when we last saw him in the cockpit with only 5 seconds on the clock. However, Nolan left us with some clues that perhaps he survived... he left us with hope. Alfred's encounter with Bruce Wayne at the end presented in exactly the same manner as his self described fantasy is obviously symbolic of Albert choosing to believe that Bruce Wayne did find his "happily ever after" ending; this interpretation would certainly make more sense after witnessing Alfred's grief at the grave site just moments earlier. Nolan crafted an ending to his trilogy, that was deliberately open to interpretation; it can be read very literally or it can be perceived in the same nuanced light that Nolan has always cast on his masterpieces. This is the truth of either interpretation, whether Bruce Wayne lived or died is secondary to the idea that the Batman was able to live on because he had become a "legend". If in doubt, I highly advise a repeat viewing of the first movie, especially the first meeting of Bruce Wayne/Batman and Ra's Al Ghul/Henri Ducard:
ReplyDeletehttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7aoVQSPGRhE
My interpretation is that Bruce Wayne died. Yes he had the option to use autopilot but he was in the Bat 4 seconds before the explosion. I think it speaks to the fact that he had overcome his fear of death and had CHOSEN to sacrifice himself even when he had a chance to escape. I saw the cafe scene as happening in Alfred's mind as it had so many times before. Nolan left it open and somewhat vague on purpose I'm sure because the main point is that Batman is a symbol and it doesn't really matter who is taking on the role of Batman, only that the Batman is there to protect the city.
ReplyDeleteI'm inclined to agree with you. Batman is a symbol and that symbol is not dead but Bruce Wayne died and is now at peace, in Alfred's mind
DeleteIts better to die a hero than to live long enough to be the villain
Deletein the 2nd movie of batman
Nolan didnt really leave anything vague. You clearly see the clues and he brings us along with the crescendo of the music, the smiling Bruce Wayne tipping his drink toward Alfred and Alfred smiling in amazement while trying to contain himself.
DeleteIf he was being Vague, he could have shot the final scene with Alfred sitting at the table and smiling to someone off camera that we don't actually see clearly. But, in this case we DO see Bruce Wayne sitting with Selina Kyle. To me, Bruce Wayne lives, and I'm ok with that.
Does it ever cross anybody's mind that it is the dc universe and there are other super heroes in this universe. Did anyone catch the reference when they asked batman if he had gotten ahold of his powerful friend isnt it possible that superman saved his ass.
ReplyDeletedid anyone know that alfread dosent even know catwoman. he thinks that she and batman are still enimies did you not see that. he doent even know that theyre together. and in his fantasy he mentioned kids i didnt see any. and yes what about his powerful friend!!! he might have survived
ReplyDeleteI am putting an end to this :D
ReplyDeletehttp://www.mtv.com/news/articles/1690203/dark-knight-rises-ending-christian-bale.jhtml
vish again
Thanks Vish, good fine ;-)
DeleteThis article is just one mans viewpoint. Just because the writer takes some celebrity quotes out of context, doesn't make the case. Sorry.
DeleteYou don't think Nolan realizes how much money a fourth installment would bring?
ReplyDeleteNolan making a fourth film based on the money it would bring in would go against what he was trying to achieve. Why ruin a perfect trilogy? He'd rather go out on top than saturate the franchise with less than stellar sequels just because they bring in money. It would tarnish the legacy.
Nolan's films make mega dollars. He won't ruin the franchise for the sake of it. He'll just make other blockbuster movies to compensate.
Who knows Batman coulda jumped out before the explosion but people thought he died so they still could do anther batman about Batman and Robin!
ReplyDeleteMy thoughts are this:-
ReplyDeleteBruce Wayne is dead at the end of this film. Nolan has left this open to debate with the scenes with Fox and Alfred at the end and as Bane aptly puts it 'there can be no despair without hope' which I think Nolan wants the audience to experience at the end with the ambiguous 'is he isn't he'. But Batman is still in the Bat when the bomb has been taken away from the city with circa 10 seconds left before the bomb, covering a 6 mile radius, detonates. Not long enough for him to escape to safety.
Also Alfred's reaction to seeing his best friend, who he thought was dead, sat down in Florence at the end is not emotionally strong enough to believe that he is physically seeing him in the flesh.
p.s I didn't like the path of Bane throughout the film. He was menacing and a seemingly strong leader throughout unti the twist came when he instantly turned into an emotional obedient puppy dog. And then got shot by cat woman. haha
I believe that batman dies, but on the other hand Bruce Wayne Lives it will probably lead to the idea of the old "bruce wayne" Mentoring robin in batman beyond cartoon series. alfred and wayne both knew that they would eventually stop the idea of batman but letting a new one come.
ReplyDeleteWhere's all this "Alfred never met Selina Kyle" BS coming from? Alfred ordered her, at the beginning of the movie, to take Mr Wayne's food into the room and leave it there. He also seen Wayne pull up her ID on the Bat-computer. Alfred knows fine well who Ms Kyle is.
ReplyDeleteI am swayed to believe Alfred actually dreamed or fantasised about Bruce being loved up with a woman, in the scene at the end. His tears at the funeral seemed pretty real, with him telling Bruce's parents that he had 'failed them'. A very emotional scene, in which there is no way he could just nod knowingly at Bruce in the cafe.
The bit about the auto-pilot being fixed is real, not just to prove that he died for Gotham. Fox wouldn't allow any news of his gadgets to be allowed out in public, so no one would know if it was fixed.
The Bat-signal was fixed by Gordon, he smiled at it, hoping he could use it some day again and see the Batman return.
I'm wondering about Blake coming in as Robin/Nightwing as he couldn't possibly afford the tech Wayne had at his disposal. Blake was an orphan remember. There was no mention of Blake being a gymnast (which the original Robin, Dick Grayson was) nor did Blake show any real combat skills.
I'll admit, I came away from the movie slightly disappointed. I thought that after the brilliance of TDK, this was going to be a spectacle. It wasn't.
But the more I think about the story, and what I have broken down here, I am inclined to go see it again. It would probably be better the second time around, much like Inception.
with the upcoming SUPERMAN new movie.... superman saves batman from the explotion!! that explain all.
ReplyDeleteThe answer is in a little thing just less then1 second... guys catwoman is wearing bruce moms necklace in the end with alfred in restaurant
ReplyDeleteI don't remember if she is actually wearing the pearls in this scene, maybe someone can confirm, but if it is true I would say it means he survived. Bruce takes the pearls back at some point in the movie, also when they are going over the will they mention one missing item, I believe he says a necklace. Also after reading these posts I was curious, can we ever actually confirm that batman is in the "bat" all I remember is the final scene (10 seconds before the bomb goes off) everyone referring to is a really close shot, but I don't remember being able to see windows or anything that would make it 100% certain what he is actually sitting in.
Deletealso after thinking a little more about it, Alfred does know that Selina took the pearls, so one could argue that Alfred could have just been dreaming them in there lol, but this would mean, if Bruce took them back earlier, why are they still missing? Also remember When Selina first steals them he says some thing along the lines of "she took them, tracker and all". It's possible Alfred used that to track them down. Anyway I'm sure it's been figured out somewhere by now :)
DeleteI think he's alive.
DeleteSelina wears the neckplace.
And Alfred does not do anything because he said in the beginning he would just nod each other.
Plus, Alfred looks a bit surprised. Of course, he does not look like: O_O
But he's surprised I think!
Viva Bale!
The way i see it is batman has always been a symbol even Wayne said so. I believe batman (not bruce wayne) died for a few reasons: 1. so his symbol would become a legend and would essentially immortalize batman (explained in batman begins) (the batman statue)2. To escape to a new life just like alfred wanted him to. So bruce wanted everyone to think batman was dead so he and selina could get new identities and live a happy life.
ReplyDeleteso, nobody knows whether he's alive or not...
ReplyDeleteI hate nolan who dosen't tell us the answer.
Give the answer or fourth movie
Now here's my view... and I think this seems like a very probable conclusion. Yes, Batman programmed the autopilot to fly miles out and let the bomb detonate; however, I believe at the point when the Bat is leaving the city, it blows up part of a building. I think this was a way in which Batman could momentarily cast a cloud of darkness around the Bat so he could jump to safety, without anyone knowing. What do you guys think?
ReplyDeleteAnd obviously Blake becomes Robin.
I think he's still alive, although I'm suspicious about Alfred's 'vision' at the end, as I think, just to make things difficult, that was what Alfred WANTED to see, and not actually him seeing Bruce.
Someone mentioned the pearls above too. So Alfred's 'vision' must be real.
DeleteCONCLUSION : BATMAN IS ALIVE
Okay. Let us look at the facts, and make our own assumptions.
ReplyDelete1. Auto Pilot has been fixed.
2. In Alfred's dream scenarios, Alfred always walks away from Bruce and wife
3. Alfred has never met Selina Kyle
4. Blake is marked to become Robin, not Batman 2.0
5. Batman, was never afraid to die. Rather, he was afraid to live as Bruce Wayne.
So, knowing these facts, lets analyse the above statements.
1. This gives us hope that Batman survives. 50/50, wheras before, everyone thought he had perished.
2. In every dream scenario, Alfred walks away because he knows that it is only a dream. This time, he acknowledges Bruce, and continues to enjoy his meal. Alfred, does not know about the relationship Bruce had with Selina.... Alfred only knew about Raz Al-Gul's daughter. If this was a dream scenario, Selina would not be there. Alfred is extremely emotional at Bruce's funeral, but that could be explained by the cafe scene being their first encounter.
3. Well, Alfred has met Selina Kyle but he is unaware of their relationship.
4. Blake discovers the batcave, and receives instruction via mail. Did anyone notice when the movie said the items were sent? It would be improbable for the items to be sent during the seige of Gotham, cause I doubt the post office would be free from looters.
5. This has been the theme all along. Bruce/Batman was never aftraid to die. Rather he was unable to move on... from his parent's death, from the death of Rachel Dawes. Would a batman who was about to save millions, and unafraid to die, be looking grim. Maybe... but not as much as having to face what he always feared... moving on from the death of his parents, Rachel, and from batman.
This synopsis is poorly written. For starters, Talia Al Ghul was played by Marion Cotillard and not "Miranda Kate" as you referred to her. Miranda Tate---with a "T" was the character's alias. Wow. Also, Alfred was not in Paris. He was in Florence by the banks of the Arno. The nuclear explosive isn't placed "inside" the Bat. It is attached to the Bat by a cable. Details are everything, m'dear. It sounds like you really need to watch the movie again and revise your summation here.
ReplyDeleteOmg!
ReplyDeleteThe reasons that batman is alive are all revealed in movie evidently like auto pilot fixed.
However the reasons that batman isnt alive are just guess like batman might be damaged by bomb.
Dont think too deeply. Just believe what you was seeing in the movie.
So, batman is alive.
(i want to see robin and batman, ... but it may not be made at least by nolan.)
Nolan y u no tell us what's goin on!!
ReplyDeleteIf it was all alfreds dream at the end he also imagined then with kids wouldn't these be there aswell
ReplyDeleteAlfred DID see Selina Kyle's face. He instructed her to deliver Mr Wayne's meal at the beginning of the movie. He seen her on Wayne's Bat-computer.
ReplyDeleteKeep the comments coming folks, everyone seems to bring a new angle to whether Batman did die at the end of the Dark Knight Rises
DeleteGuys,how did Bat survived that explosion so Fox could check it put? That aircraft would be vaporized.
ReplyDeleteI think batman jumped out when Blake thought the bomb blew. It was a distraction to make it look like batman came flying through to save the day.
ReplyDeleteYa that's the only scene where he could have got out. And like you said, it's a perfekt distraction.
DeleteYou are all missing something that is incredibly obvious here.
ReplyDeleteHe flew the batwing with a bomb that had a 6 mile coverage, we see him in shots moments before the blast so even if he did escape the blast would have got him.
Think about it, the only person that could have got out of that blast in time would have been superman, and I mean it's not like Nolan is making a superman film is i... OOOHH SSSHHIIII - Your mind = blown.
I think the best possibility is that Drake becomes the new Batman for two reasons.
ReplyDelete1. After the success of the Avengers, you know damn well there will need to be a Justice League movie.
2. Most people don't like to see new actors play recent characters... UNLESS it is explained.
Blake could be the new Batman for several more movies, AND for the Justice League, and people would be more likely to see it.
Blake* not Drake
DeleteJustice League movie in the works http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/movies/news/a392833/justice-league-movie-targeted-for-2015-release-by-warner-bros.html
DeleteBatman was in the escape pod of the Bat. It protected him from the radiation.
ReplyDeleteBatman is alive... if you pay attention, he fixed the autopilot on "The Bat" and so he used the autopilot to drive the Bat 6 miles away from Gothem to save the city. And at the end, you see him with cat woman ... I only noticed this the second time I watched it. You don't literally see him fixing the autopilot but Fox finds out that the autopilot was fixed by wayne himself.. I can't explain myself.. just watch it again!
ReplyDeleteWell he may have survived, the auto pilot was fixed and there is no telling when or where he may have jumped out. He did fix the auto-pilot and the bat can fly the whole distance on its own. Maybe he jumped out of the bat long before the explosion instead of 10 secs before.
ReplyDeleteThere is simply no way he could have survived the explosion. It showed you him in the Bat moments before the explosion and there is no way he could have got to a safe distance.
ReplyDeleteHold on.... water isn't affected by an atom bomb, Batman ejecting from the cockpit of the Bat would have left him in the water. All he had to do was go a few feet under the water and he would have been ok.
Here what really happened:
ReplyDeleteBruce Wayne intended to leave Gotham once he saved the city and
have Robin take his place as Gotham's new hero. He had already planned his exit by writing his will leaving the batcave to Robin e.t.c.
He didn't intend to die however this all changed when (a) he
was stabbed by Talia (similar to when Commodus stuck the knife
into Maximus in Gadiator). The knife wound did not kill him immediately but he knew the wound was deep enough to be eventually
fatal and (b) Talia flooded the fusion chamber thereby making it impossible to stabilise the bomb thereby leaving him with no choice
but to fly the bat out to sea with the bomb.
The scene at the cafe is in Alfred's dream (just look at his
reaction when he see's Bruce Wayne alive. If it was real he
would of shown more emotion).
The scene in relation to the autopilot is just Christopher
Nolan playing with the audience (the reality is Batman did
not have enough time to eject from the Bat before the bomb
exploded).
Bruce Wayne fixed the bat signal so Gordon could use if for
Robin.
Christopher Nolan already said he will not direct anymre
Batman movies and Christian Bale said he will not be starring
in anymore Batman movies so alas Bruce Wayne / Batman so as
far as Christopher Nolan is concerned Bruce Wayne /Batman is
dead..
Sorry to disappoint you all but Batman is dead. Talia killed
Batman when she stuck the knife in him (similar to when Commodus
stuck the knife into Maximus in Gadiator).
When did Batman find the time to write up his will?
ReplyDeleteWhy wasn't the Bat destroyed when the bomb went off?
Remember the mushroom cloud?
The only way there could have been a mushroom cloud is if the bomb had been dropped into the water.
If it had gone off in mid air then wouldn't the explosion looked more 'circular' (what ever the correct terminology is).
This comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteEarlier in the movie mr fox is introducing THE BAT
ReplyDeletemr fox points out Auto pilot 2 times and bruce ha s a interesting look on his face
this what i think happened
when alfred gets fired, alfred wishes thst bruce has a family with a wife and kids and that they (alfred and bruce) can have nothing 2 do with each other
then i think bruce breaks the auto pilot on purpose to fool everyone like its not working. ill explain more later. once he fools fox about the auto pilot bruce fixes it.
when batman carries the bomb on the bat i reckon auto pilot was on and he jumped out
he escaped to live a normal life with his kids and wife in italy
then again batman said he wasnt afraid of dying
ReplyDeletehe said he didnt want to die while gothem crumbles
so if he didnt commit suicide he will die while gothem crumbles
If you watch closely, there are shadows going over Batman's face at the end when he is supposed to be flying in the Bat. This wouldn't happen if he were flying over the ocean, Nolan never does anything without a reason. The shot of him driving isn't him in the Bat, he is driving something else. The public believe that Batman is dead, Bruce Wayne and Selina Kyle have the clean slate program and can therefore disappear. Bruce Wayne left Robin the bag with the map to lead him to the cave to hand over the reins. Bruce even said to him in the car that 'anyone can be Batman - it is just a symbol'. The pearls still have a tracking device which is why Alfred is not surprised to see them, he knew where they were. He probably went there to see him
ReplyDeleteMaybe just as Bruce Wayne wanted everyone in the film to think he was dead maybe he wanted us the viewers to think he's dead too, so he can live in peace. *Mind blown*
ReplyDeleteIt's quite obvs that Batman did survive. Why would there be a scene about the autopilot being fixed if not? Before taking the bat out to sea Batman also says that theres no autopilot. Why would he lie? Because he wanted everyone to think that he wouldn't survive. Another funny thing is that theres not proof that Batman is in the Bat before the explosion. He could have been in any vehicle.
ReplyDeleteAlthough they mention that the autopilot was fixed, it didn't look like batman jumped out. It's one of those annoying interpretive things that Nolan like to do. "Is Alfred imagining the scenario or is it fact?"
ReplyDeleteAs for "The Batman" himself, it's an icon. They've had stories that stemmed off of what happens after Bruce Wayne can no longer be Batman a million times before. Some it was his son, others a random guy in really futuristic world (Batman Beyond). This "Blake" character just seems to be yet another version of it.
The only thing that could counter that statement is that they've not made it clear who John Blake actually is. All that was given was his newer name and his middle name of "Robin". It's unfortunate if they don't make another movie just because it'd leave the whole series on a really stupid cliffhanger that leaves you with more questions than answers. It'll be just like LOST. "Are you happy? Did it all make sense? Why did it all end in a church?"-Joker
Batman could have jumped out when he shot at that building before flying over the bridge and into the bay. That is not likely to have happened but it is another possiblitity. :P
ReplyDeleteAm I the only one who is confused by Alfred's reaction at the end of the film?
ReplyDeleteI mean,he is having a good weep in front of Bruce's grave and then he is not really surprised at seeing him in the cafe.Besides the last scene is identical to a previous scene shown while Alfred talks about his illusion.This is similar to the ending of Inception and the scene with Cobb's kids.
They left this trilogy's end opened,and that's why I think both Christopher and Jonathan Nolan are fucking trailblazers.Period.
People keep commenting on Alfred's reaction. Do you not recall how he described his wish to Bruce about this scene? " You wouldn't say anything to me, nor me to you. But we'd both know that you'd made it, that you were happy." That paints a picture of two people simply seeing each other, and pretending nothing is out of the ordinary, because they are simply having NORMAL lives. Besides, consider that Alfred learned of the auto-pilot being fixed just as Fox did, and with this knowledge he, like any normal person I think, starts to believe he made it out alive. I think taking in those facts, Alfred would begin to EXPECT to see Bruce sitting there, now that they both have shared the significance of what it means.
ReplyDeleteFinally, why are so many people just assuming that Bruce/Batman was IN the bat when it went out over the ocean? He had autopilot fixed, why would he need to be there? I definitely want to see the movie again and try to find a clue as to whether you can actually tell if he is in it, because I just remember an up-close on his eyes/face. The filmography is done so that you believe he is there, but that is intentional and done to create this very discussion. But many people are missing the OBVIOUS...WHO'S TO SAY THAT WITH AUTO-PILOT FIXED HE WAS EVER ACTUALLY IN THERE TO START WITH?
Love it, keep the debate alive people! Some good points here but lots of "what ifs". I think Nolan wants us to debate whether Batman dies in the Dark Knight Rises forever!
Deletethey shoudlve filmed batman and catwoman having sex
ReplyDeleteI can't remember now as it's a week or so since I saw the film.. but were there any references in the film about Bruce Wayne's body/corpse not being found?
ReplyDeleteThe Bat was recovered and shown to be pretty much entirely in tact (hood and all) in the Lucius Fox scene, so wouldn't it stand to reason that Batman's body would have been inside it when they salvaged it from the ocean (assuming the hood wasn't blown open by the blast)?
This could be explained a couple ways I guess. Either the body was inside the Bat and Bruce Wayne was indeed laid to rest at the cemetery (Lucius' surprise at the autopilot scene then would be his realisation that Bruce Wayne's death was unecessary and avoidable and that he essentially sacrificed himself)
...or alternatively no body was ever recovered and it was assumed to be washed out to sea, in which case the tombstone in the cemetery was just a memorial and not marking a grave.. supporting the case that he survived and faked his death to start afresh away from Gotham...
I would say Nolan has deffo deliberately left the ending so it can be read both ways.. that either Bruce Wayne died or survived depending on what you want to believe.
The bomb was a neutron bomb, which the sole purpose is to give off a small blast and give off allot of gamma radiation.
ReplyDeleteThe way I see it he survived. Two reasons why are, the fact he was not recovered in the vehicle at the end even thought it is completely intact indicating that he either escaped or wasn't in there at all!
Who is to say that he wasn't using another form of transportation when seen in the vehicle moments before detonation?
The director has done a very good job, as this debate shows of getting the audience to ask allot of questions etc.. but in the end it is a super hero film and how many superheroes actually die?
This is ridiculous. The end of the film is not open for debate.Your article completely misses Nolan's ending, that's all. Wayne doesn't die- in fact, the entire point of the last 10 minutes of the film is to demonstrate the fact that he survived.
ReplyDeleteFox had previously told Bruce Wayne that the Bat's auto-pilot didn't work. In Fox's subsequent scene in the R&D department at Wayne Enterprises after Wayne's "death", it's revealed that Wayne fixed the auto-pilot 6 months prior to the bomb's explosion. Nolan presents this scene AFTER the explosion to clue the audience in to Wayne's deception: he programed the auto-pilot to fly the bomb out over the ocean where it would explode harmlessly, leaving Wayne himself free to bail out, meet up with Selina Kyle, and take care of loose ends in Gotham before departing with Kyle for a fresh start at a life without Batman. There isn't any wiggle-room in this synopsis- this is clearly, definitively, what happened.
You have also clearly missed the significance of John Blake in the Batcave. Blake doesn't just "discover" the Batcave- Wayne clearly leaves him GPS coordinates to locate it, along with the duffle bag bag containing his gear. And when did Wayne do that? After bailing from the auto-piloted Bat. Same with the repaired Bat-Signal- Gordon didn't fix that himself, the look on his face is one of astonishment and surprise at seeing the shattered glass repaired- Wayne did this as a parting gift to Gordon.
Whoever posted saying "How did Batman escape when we saw him piloting the Bat only seconds before?" (I'm paraphrasing- can't remember the exact quote, don't care to scroll up and find it again)- are you serious? It's called EDITING, and film makers use it to heighten the dramatic effect of a scene. Why didn't Nolan SHOW us Batman safely ejecting from the Bat? Because it would have effectively killed the dramatic tension of his film's finale. The film clearly stated that the bomb could kill everyone within a six-mile radius. We know the Bat didn't fly six miles out to sea in only the few seconds that Nolan cuts to as the bomb counts down- clearly, time between events in the bomb final sequence have been edited out by Nolan for excitement's sake alone, and that editing includes Bruce's escape from the Bat.
As for the "Alfred imagined Bruce and Selina" theory- anyone who honestly believes that Nolan closes the Bruce/Alfred storyline with a DREAM SEQUENCE from Alfred is out of their mind.
Bruce Wayne and Selina Kyle's appearance in the restaurant with Alfred is not a dream sequence. It's the audience's payoff for being smart enough to figure out what the montage of closing segments occurring immediately before it- the scenes with Fox, Gordon, etc.- actually meant. Wayne faked Batman's death to redeem Batman in the city's eyes. Wayne faked his own death so that he could start a new life without the necessity for being Batman OR Bruce Wayne. The scene with Alfred is Wayne acknowledging that Alfred had been right, and that it was time for him to move on with his own life, and leave Batman and Gotham behind. Period.
You should think about actually paying attention to a film if you're going to go to the trouble of posting an entire article about it on the internet.
I don't get it. There isn't a debate. It's all set up. Nolan laid it all out for a reason. Not interpretation. The autopilot, Alfred explaining where he goes so Bruce goes there himself to let him know. The fixed bat signal (before knightwing). Didn't anyone watch this film or understand Nolan's style. Watch it again. Its all there.
ReplyDeleteNolan deliberately made the ending confusing so people would be talking about the movie. some will think he died some will say he survives.
ReplyDeletebut i think batman's "powerful friend" saved him at the last second... SUPERMAN
it would be a while before the next batman movie would appear. he would semi retire first for robin to take over.
the next series of films would show superman, wonder woman, maybe flash, green lantern and link them all together and a Justice league movie would be made. Maybe in the justice league movie, there is a need for batman to come back and join the justice league.
Yep i agree once the new supes film is brought up to date reinvented, then it makes it plausible for Superman to have saved Batman and thus lead us into the justice league.
DeleteIts open to interpretation, but I believe that Batman survives, however improbable it would be in real life. There are so many setups that lead the viewer to the payoff. Unless the entire ending after the explosion is a dream sequence, ( which I highly doubt) i can't see the cafe scene being a dream or fantasy of Alfred's. Everything that Nolan put in the movie seems to be there for a reason- the clue about the autopilot being repaired in secret, the necklace being missing but seen on Selina Kyle's neck, even te slow buildup of the music and the uplifting end to the music as Wayne smiles at Alfred and tips his glass. Even in the begining of "The Dark Knight", when Wayne is talking to Lucious about needing a different suit to be lighter and faster, Lucious tells him that he can redesign the suit but he will be more vulnerable to gunshots and knives. And sure enough, miranda tate stabs him at the end of TDKR.
ReplyDeleteIt just seems to me like everything that Nolan has setup up has a payoff at the end. Its not like at the end of Inception, where the top is spinning and starts to falter and it cuts away suddenly. Theres real clues that we follow from A to Z and in the end we see Wayne smiling at Alfred. And some say Alfred didnt show emotion, but I saw a look of surprise and joy on his face which he suddenly tried to keep in check. Sure, they could have had him jump out of his chair and run over to the table, but really, it just would have looked terrible. I think it was done just right
I watched movie and if i remember correctly Alfred winks at audience first then it cuts to the cafe ending. The ending is open for conjecture and interpretation and thats what makes this a great film and debate. Also Nolan i think is producing the new Superman film, it would be great to think he had a lot of input into this film with Batman in mind for a collaboration in the justice league.
Delete? When does Alfred wink? I didn't see it in theaters, and I just watched it again online (yeah, I know it's wrong to watch it online. But I did pay to see it in theaters once at least) He didn't wink.
DeleteSuperman? SUPERMAN?? WTF. No. NO. If you're going to start saying that SUPERMAN saved Bruce Wayne from the explosion, then we've just suddenly dispensed with all tangible and relevant explanations. Hell, let's just assume that a magical unicorn with a jet pack showed up and that Bruce and the unicorn flew away together to live in the clouds. That makes about as much sense as suggesting that Nolan had SUPERMAN, who has never been referenced in Nolan's Batman films AT ALL, show up- OFF SCREEN, no less- and save Batman. Wtf. WTF. You're inventing your own insane theories based on no evidence at all, for a film that requires none- how is anyone, anywhere, under the impression that the end of this film is "open to interpretation"? It ISN'T. AT ALL. BRUCE BAILS OUT. ALFRED SEES HIM IN THE RESTAURANT. THE END.
ReplyDeleteFirstly i think the ending can be viewed with different aspects. And secondly take a chill pill, deep breaths,calm down its only a film. I never said Superman saves Batman only that it would be great (for me) if that was a possible ending. Only lamenting.
DeleteIf we're going with a "different aspects" logic, then you can apply that to anything. Maybe Luke Skywalker just imagined destroying the Death Star, and Frodo just imagined going to Mordor. That's a ridiculous way to try and force an open-ended conclusion that cannot be supported by the film itself. The film's conclusion is clear cut, not ambiguous. Saying that the ending is open to interpretation implies that Nolan left it up to the audience. He absolutely did not. If you can't grasp the elements that tell you how the film ends, it's unfortunate for you, but it doesn't change the fact that the ending is indeed very clearly defined. It wasn't Superman, it wasn't a dream, and Bruce Wayne didn't die. As much as anyone chooses to argue that 2 + 2 is 5, the facts tell us that it isn't. It's the same here- stop arguing for the existence of questions that aren't there. Watch the film again- or several more times- and allow the logic of Nolan's storytelling to penetrate your brain.
ReplyDeleteOk i didnt realise i was talking to Chris Nolan, my apologies.
DeleteYes. Of course. I must be Chris Nolan to be capable of having enough basic logic to understand the conclusion to the film. That makes sense. Only the film's director could possibly see past so many confusing things and inexplicably ambiguous scenes to arrive at a totally obvious conclusion. Good job, you got me. I'm Chris Nolan.
ReplyDeleteWith everything you have said, i conclude you are delusional to think that there is only one ending to be considered. I cant fathom if you are really interested in other peoples opinions,or just argumentative as a trait in your persona. With every persons opinion on this films ending i have sat back and thought everyones conclusion is plausible. I do give you credit though that your at least 50 percent right if he does survive.
DeleteWhat's "delusional" is to assume the stance that every conceivable point of view is relevant and/or plausible. Going by your line of thought, we must then concede that NO film or story ever written has ANY definite conclusion. Everything, everywhere, must be left indefinite and ambiguous so that we can carefully accommodate each and every single point of view and not hurt anyone's feelings, no matter how little attention they paid to the plot.
DeleteNolan is telling a story, and any story worth telling has a conclusion. The conclusion is defined by its author, but is also dependent upon the facts that the author presents. TDKR is made up of a series of events that lead to a defined conclusion, so no- it isn't a matter of what's "plausible", it's a matter of what actually took place. Apparently the film that you saw was much more confusing than the film that I saw.
If I come on this forum and say that *I* think the end of the movie consists of Batman turning into a dragon and eating Gotham city, then- by your logic- you genuinely HAVE to receive my theory with just as much gravity and welcoming plausibility as everyone else's, even though it's clear that my theory is entirely wrong. I know it's wrong, and you know it's wrong. Batman didn't turn into a dragon. You seem to be saying that my frustration with people's lack of clarity and basic grasp of simple storytelling logistics here makes me some kind of a flawed persona. Well, you must be more clever than I am, gleaning so much insight from a few disjointed blog posts. You should write a dissertation on your amazing ability to figure out a person's whole psyche based on nothing more than anonymous internet movie reviews. That's pretty incredible. And how open-minded of you, really.
But frankly, there isn't anything noble or mature about placating theories that are completely off-base simply to look like a nice guy. That serves no purpose at all. I have no grievance with you, personally. It's not my place to call your personality into question. I know nothing about you. I'm sorry you feel the need to make the issue personal.
I do however, continue to disagree with your inclination to gloss over the facts in favor of theories that are not substantiated by the film. This is the entire point. The synopsis of the film isn't full of holes that allow for a debate. There isn't a debate to be had here, which is I suppose, what baffles me. The "debate" only exists in some weird, existential kind of limbo, where ANYTHING could be said, irrespective of actual proof or hard facts. The arguments you're supporting are simply not supported by the film, and so I'm confused by your insistence on acknowledging them as legitimate arguments. They make no sense.
But here's this: I'm sorry if I've upset you. Not my goal. We disagree, but I'm sure you're a decent person, and I'm not trying to blow up all over you about this. Everyone who thinks that Batman dies, etc., is going to continue to think that no matter what I might have to say about it, so it matters very little. And what's more,I actually wasn't attempting to make you mad, pal. I was simply completely astonished that anyone could miss what is, all in all, a very obvious ending. But, whatever- if it pleases you, then sure: Batman died. Alfred had a dream. Superman saved the world. And whatever else anyone anywhere can possible think up. I must have been completely wrong about everything- my bad. And that's perfectly fine. I wish you well, I hope things go your way. Let me know how that Justice League movie works out.
Alright, I just got back from the movie and thought I would mention that Wayne did have a very grim outlook on the whole situation. He seemed a bit suicidal, and to be honest, I think he just went back to save Gotham then he used the bomb as an excuse for suicide. The autopilot scene at the end can be interpreted in two ways: he survived through the autopilot or he died by choice even though he knew he would have the option to use it. My personal belief is that he knew of the option but decided to go ahead with the plan of self sacrifice. It would give Gotham a new fallen hero, in light of Harvey dent's newly discovered truth.
ReplyDeleteI agree with this line of thinking
DeleteI think that Batman after crossing the bridge in the Bat jumped out or ejected with the autopilot on, therefore his body's never found. This also clears him from the 6 mile radius problem.
ReplyDeletealso as others have pointed out as Alfred walks out in the cafe in florence, it shows that he was content and happy that bruce had finally found happiness and love with selina kyle.
Chris Nolan is a genius, to create such an amazing finale leaving everyone to their own conclusions but also being able to go 2 different ways if he chooses to make a 4th. This debate could go on for years but at the end of the day people are entitled to their own oppinion! Mine personally is that batman survived, you don't see the timer at 5 seconds and batman in the same shot so who's to say he was inside it. Plus the sad expression could be to do with the thought of never putting on the batman suit ever again. One person has already stated a very strong clue that he survived which was Selina Kyle wearing Bruce Waynes mothers necklace when Alfred see's them. Once again, this is what i believe and i expect others to disagree!
ReplyDelete